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Shout Above The Noise

When are the secular progressives going to open their eyes ?


Edmund Burke said that 'All that is needed for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing'. With all the inter-sect violence within Islam.. Iraq, Ethiopa... one would have thought that governments would have the courage to quietly sand up and say "No" to any religious talk of violence against others.

The Silent Majority

This is why the secular "progressive" liberals won't open their eyes

Because discrimination is bad, therefore you must be completely indiscriminate.


The same is true of the mosques in the USA.
80% of them are run or were originally financed by Wahhabists from Saudi Arabia.

Our own Christchurch Mosque had troubles with Wahhabists only a year ago.
Threats and other stuff going on.
The Local Labour MP was alerted to it at the time.


Probably local Muslims take as little notice of these preachers as Roman Catholics take of the Pope etc concerning birth control!

Provoking them in a monocultural could simply be a self-fulfilling prophesy (like most Biblical prophesy actually!)

But that is what Christian fundamentalists actually want to happen. Revelation to happen.

Matt L

Hi Pete - you have labeled be a fundamentalist before and I personally don't have much regard for the current church thinking on the book of Revelations.

Most of it is handed down thinking - and hasn't been tempered with the true nature of God.


I like the quote above:

"Edmund Burke said that 'All that is needed for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing'."

Good men (and women) are being proactive.

For example on National Radio tonight, Maureen Garing interviewed the Rabbi of a Wellington synagogue about the Jewish New Year and associated celebrations over the next couple of weeks.

She (the rabbi) said that the synagogue has invited local worshippers from Anglican church and a MOSQUE to join with them in a particular part of the celebrations.

This is great. "Turning the other cheek" to quote a well-known pioneer of Christianity!

I am sure Burke would agree that it is better that good men do nothing, than bad men doing something!!


Just bought another book with Islam content: "Why I am a Christian: Leading thinkers explain why they believe". Dr. Ergun Caner is a Turkish Sunni immigrant who converted to Christianity. Following are some interesting quotes:

"Two types of Muslims move to America. A few come hoping to escape their Islamic background and restrictive lifestyle. They take on the culture of America readily - the dress, the speech, and the exuberant way of life. We were not in that category. We were among the majority: those who come to America to change it. We were proud of our Islamic heritage. . .

[we lived in Columbus, Ohio] The Muslims of Columbus were united in their vision and determined to see America become an Islamic nation. . . A common misconception about Muslims moving to America is that they come seeking freedom and democracy, or to share in the glory of the world's only true superpower. For most Muslim immigrants, nothing could be further from the truth. . .

One of the most appealing aspects of Christianity for me, in stark contrast to Islam, was the invitation to ask difficult questions. . . Unlike the Christian apologetic community that encourages investigation, Islam suppresses doubt and questions. . . If a legitimate Muslim scholar questions any accepted tradition in Islam, violence and the threat of murder will inevitably arise. . . In every country identifying itself as an "Islamic Republic", Sharia law demands death for questioning any orthodox doctrine of Islam or for maligning Muhammad. . . Consequently, there is no public debate in the Islamic world regarding questions of faith. It is simply too dangerous. . . There are outspoken Muslims and there are curious Muslims. But there are no outspoken curious Muslims. They are dispatched immeidtaely or, like Rushdie, forced into silent exile. . .

Intrinsic to Islam is the principle of theocracy, the political institutionalization of Sharia law. This is perhaps the most difficult aspect of Islam for Americans to grasp. The wisdom of separating religion and government is, to us, self-evident. We understand intuitively that true religion must be freely chosen, not imposed. But Islam is not simply a religion, a set of beliefs one adopts in an effort to know and please God. It is an entire sociopolitical system, and it must be imposed if it is not willingly adopted. In this sense, Islam is like a religious form of Marxism."

That should do for now. These ideas are repeatedly expressed by almost every single person who has walked away from Islam in any part of the world one can think of. How long will it take us to face reality?


It is becoming increasingly clear - Christian fundamentalists are spoiling for a fight.

Well at least we have the police and the army to protect the Muslims.


peter, peter, peter..... I am not going to let your little personality foibles put me off you. If you keep denying the facts people will start calling you a religious nutter you know...

From that hate-filled bastion of Islamophobia, DW-TV (5 minute video clip):~

Not a Fundamentalist Christian, not even a Christian, this moderate Muslim reporter found the Muslim community riddled with radicalism when she went in undercover.

Note the angry responses from all the people in the market to the presence of the camera. The other side of the world from America, but it completely aligns with the Turkish man's view of Islam & its view of the West doesn't it?

As Aragorn said to Theoden when he refused to risk open war peter: "War is upon you! (and we didn't start it)"

John Boy

"Well at least we have the police and the army to protect the Muslims."

Not that they will need it Peter. They will be the ones with the guns.


Yes John Boy I can see what you mean.

The fundamentalists will be provoking a few Muslim nutters to get violent.

And if warfare breaks out, they will claim to be "conscientious objectors" so they do not have to bear the consequences!

The world is basically full of Muslim people. Huge numbers of them would be like mainstream Christians, locked into the rituals without any great enthusiasm. You'll never mobilise them.

While I think of it, I happened to stumble across Brian Tamaki on TV on Sunday - a group of teenagers were watching it for entertainment value. Shrieks of laughter as this man rabbitted on about "The Curse" - and Christians he knows that wife beaters etc.

Actually he did look more like a stand up comic than a cleric. But you should have seen the poker faces in the congregation.

Do I recall correctly that Broadcasting Standards Authority acted once in the past regarding his preaching on TV?


Once again you avoid a central question on this blog?

Instead you show your antipathy towards Christianity and those who hold to conservative (or fundies as you call them) positions on their faith.

The questioon posed by the article is -- The religion of peace peacaful?

The facts say NO!!

All around the world Saudi Arabia exports Wahabbism which is a virulent form of Islam which in it'self is not a peaceful religion.

Just compare the founders of Christianity and Islam.

Have you been burned by men or women in the visible Church?


peter, I have reached the point where I will not dignify your "answer" with any further response.


I found this article for you.

It makes compelling reading even if the country wasn't Islamic.
That it is, is even more poignant.

John Boy

You can take the piss all you like Peter. I'd be gone long before you if I had to renounce Christianity although it may never come to that here soley because of Islam.

They'd get you as a poof later because you can wait - you don't frighten them because you don't stand for anything of value. They see your "tolerance" as a useful means to an end rather than valuable and they'll play you for the sucker you are.

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