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« The cellphone debate | Main | Just a heads-up »



I agree Ian, especially on the partial birth which I totally detest. No excuse.
Also his comments about if his daughter got pregnant, he would not want her punished.

However this is all I will disagree with him on.
I wonder if he will pcik Condoleezza Rice for VP ???

I know you will laugh, but
there is MORE to be exposed in coming month, I think.
Bush will be safe on his property in Paraguay though.

John Boy

Its does compute because some (lots?) don't perceive life exists until some abstract point later on. If they are wrong, as I think they are, there's going to be a huge reckoning. Imagine the "Hi mum, remember me?" on the far side. Ouch.
Its a frighteningly big number indeed but as we see in Manurewa life is cheap. Dying? OK but hang on until I've got my RTD's.

Acid Comments

Abortions will probably double in the USA if 'Brack Obummer' gets elected president.

He's ultra liberal and what I've read about him sometime back very pro-abortion.


Actually Ian, a great deal of the opposition to the Iraq war came from the American right. Many of the relevant voices were opposed to both abortion and aggressive, unecessary war.

So while you may certainly have a valid point regarding "liberals", it dosen't really change anything regarding the morality of the Iraq war.


I agree with googoocachoo.
You do need to look at the Iraq war on its own merits (or otherwise) - just like any other war. Recent relelations in a book by one of Bush's top aides don't look too favourable - hence the red herring I suspect.

Abortion is a separate issue altogether - belonging with such issues as birth control and medicine.

They are both ethical questions but separate questions.

And Paula - what got you onto the track of Condolezza Rice as VP for Barack Obama? She is part of the Republican regime.


Terrifyingly, I agree with peter :-0

These are two separate issues and to try and debate them together is ridiculous. There is no way you will ever generate a sane, rational debate on either issue.



The simplest way to conclude discussion on both the Iraq war fatalities and abortions per year is to recognise that each situation exists.

People keep going to war, regardless.

People keep aborting babies, regardless.

The power to change lies somewhere in each of us, at a personal level, at that moment where we decide to act.


Yes Peter I know, BUT did you read the article in the Herald about her yesterday?
Then you will understand, but thinking about it 2 hours later, I realised Barack probably cannot put her in over Hlllary, and I DO NOT believe he will have Hillary, you cannot put new wine into old wineskins.

And I agree with you and
googoochachoo about separate issues.


For those who think abortions will go up under an administration that votes in favour of it still being allowed, an interesting note to take into consideration is the abortion statistics under the Clinton administration (Bill that is), a pro-abortion administration vs the Bush administration, a philisophically anti-abortion administration.

Under Clinton, the abortion statistics went down - under Bush, they have gone up. There are many more factors that feed into the abortion discussion - socio economic factors.

Obama philosophically does not agree with abortion, but he philosophically believes in the choice being available. He believes in removing the need for a woman to choose abortion.

Agree with it or not, to assume that under an Obama administration the number of abortions will rise is to miss the nuances in the factors that feed into the decision to have an abortion. People don't simply choose to abort a life because the choice is there. There is much more in play than the simple availability of the choice.

Obama could very well bring down the abortion rate while still voting in favour of the choice being allowed.


The heading was:-

Rice rethinks and makes an about turn on nation building.


THANK YOU servant, well said.
I thought that about Bush, but didn't know enough to comment.

You know I am ASHAMED of the 'spin' from Sean Hannity, it has really opened my eyes, and now the attacks from the conservatives towards Michelle Obama, is discusting, I once totally associated myself with Republicans, but NO MORE.
That is not to say I am
endorsing a lot of stupid left policies.


Servant, unfortunately Obama's record on abortion does not match the impression he is giving.

While we was in the Illinois state legislature, he voted multiple times to prevent legislation being passed that would protect infants that accidentally survived an abortion from being killed outside the womb.

In March 2001, Obama was the sole speaker in opposition to the bill on the floor of the Illinois Senate. He said: "We're saying they are persons entitled to the kinds of protections provided to a child, a 9-month child delivered to term. I mean, it would essentially bar abortions, because the equal-protection clause does not allow somebody to kill a child." So according to Obama, "they," babies who survive abortions or any other preterm newborns, should be permitted to be killed because giving legal protection to preterm newborns would have the effect of banning all abortions.



This baby survived an abortion: miracle baby


Some unusually inspired feedback above for your enlightenment Ian!

It seems that disenchantment with George W Bush reaches far and wide.

Equally, Barack Obama (coming from nowhere) has triumphed for good reasons. His chances of becoming President are higher than John Key to become prime minister. He has attracted over $200 million in backing compared wth McCain's $80 million. Isn't it wonderful having no restraint on the amount you spend to gain office?

Ha Ha Ha !!!

Ryan Sproull


There are, as I understand it, constraints on political donations in the US - just no constraints on campaign spending.


Well said Lucyna. I have also mentioned this previously and in my mind it puts Barack in an incredibly rare policy position compared with most lawmakers. His belief is simply extremist. He alone is a person who doesn't just support murder in the womb, but murder outside the womb to. I have a word for that: INFANTICIDE.


Abortions are a great gift to society.
You should all be greatful.

Embryo selection should take place and genetic fitness tests will be common.


Because these are my genes, and my chromosomes, and I can chose what I want to do, when I want to do it, and how I want.

Without hillbilly religious nutters interfering.

Just be grateful that there isn't a vaccine developed that can altered your neurochemistry and you lose the delusional belief in god etc etc or worse, all turns you all into Sodomites.


"Abortions are a great gift to society."

You are a sick unit fugley!


Daddy, of course abortions are a great gift to society. Do we want MORE canidadates for the gangs?

Perhaps it is time to consider enforced abortion for pregnant un-partnered maori and pacific teens.


Now that's an telling statement.
Are profiling people here, the liberal left will have your balls if you don't watch out.

18,000 kids a year if left in situ will be born 9 months later.

the mothers will grow character by having to grow up and we won't have to close school.
manufacturers will have 18,000 more potential cuctomers and the economy benefits.

it's a win win situation.
lets ban abortions now unless the mother is medically at risk of death.

Everyone's rights are looked after and we make a shit load of money.

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